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File: 1425816477528.jpg (70.35 KB, 450x600, 450px-Socrates_Louvre.jpg) ImgOps Exif iqdb

 No.908

Tell us what you're currently reading. Or maybe you'd like to share some words of your own philosophies?
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 No.909

I'm currently reading Plato: Symposium and the death of socrates.

The content of the book is quite heavy in matters of philosophical speech. I feel the subjective context in this book didn't lend itself properly to be translated into objective English. Many people are offended by this book (maybe it's because of the 'love' for males and the disregard of females' capability to be intellectual), but I'm enjoying the read regardless of these things.

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 No.910

>>908
I'm currently reading Louis-Ferdinand Céline's Journey to the End of Night. From what I've read so far it certainly captured my feelings towards war in the sections I've read so far. The almost relentless cynicism and pessimism made the book quite an enjoyable read so far (though the WWI setting for the first part can also be a bit traumatic/depressing, remembering the millions of young men that suffered through this).

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 No.1070

>>908
Personal philosophy? Ok, I'll bump to get this going.
One outlook on existence I'm working on right now is that if there is a world outside my own mind, there's no way I can know it exists by way of any kind of external verification because of the Phaneron. Basically, I'm trapped inside my own mind. That doesn't mean I'm a solipsist, though, mostly just because it isn't conducive to dealing with the world or the illusion I'm experiencing. It would make me feel lonely and I don't like feeling lonely. So I guess it's just realism with some extra baggage and the acknowledgement that any attempt at objectivity is actually just attempting to prove that your definitions of the sensory feedback you get are always consistent with what you actually experience. As for the universe/cosmos/whatever itself, following my premise I think it's possible for any kind of universe to exist, as long as it's internally consistent.
What do you think?

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 No.1071

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>>908
>Tell us what you're currently reading.
Currently reading pic related; it's a collection of theses covering mass consumerism and its similarities with religion, commodity fetishism and generally American sociology at the time.
>Or maybe you'd like to share some words of your own philosophies?
https://ensorcel.org/metamodernism-a-primer/ basically covers it; my personal philosophy is heavily influenced by Albert Camus' The Myth of Sisyphus. I generally agree with his question over whether or not we should commit suicide is the only serious philosophical question; Wisecrack covered this topic rather well imho: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KI25easQs2k

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 No.1073

>>1071
I've just recently finished The Revolution of Everyday Life, Society of the Spectacle is the next on my list!
How do you like it so far?

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 No.1075

Not sure exactly what counts as Philosophy, but I've got a few lined up to read soon

Fear and Trembling by Kierkegaard
The Stranger by Camus (re-read)
The Plague by Camus
The Fall by Camus
Nausea by Sartre

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 No.1086

I just finished Cat's Cradle.
The fuarrrk.

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 No.1087

Just finished The Glass Cage by Nicholas Carr, not sure what to read now. I'm considering Leviathan by Hobbes or something by/about Marx because I kind of know nothing about his theories and that's meh.

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 No.1097

I've been reading a lot of literary theory and semiotics related things recently, am about to dive into Derrida's Writing and Difference for the 3rd time and try to actually get beyond the first few pages.

>>1075
That's a sweet list, they definitely all count as 'philosophical'

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 No.1104

>>1097
Thanks, it'll probably be a while before I get to them since I have about 4 books I'm going to read before them, but I'm looking forward to them all the same.

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 No.1263

The Sublime Object of Ideology by Zizek
Might do Plato's Republic or Psychoanalysis and Buddhism after that

or I might just keep diving into more Zizek.

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 No.1266

>>1086
i read that book just after starting a new job at a defense r&d lab.

heh

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 No.1269

About halfway through Basic Writings of Nietzche, and I can see why he's hyped-up a lot.
Machiavelli's The Prince got me started in philosophy out of curiosity, and I'm planning on reading Essays by Michael Montaigne next. Any recommendations for a complete newcomer?

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 No.1270

>>1269
I'm new to Philosophy and I've only really heard of Niezetche, and some of the older ones like Plato, Aristotle and Socrates. Could someone help with an introduction to Philosophy? I like some of Niezetche's ideas, like the transvaluation of all values but I don't really no any more than the wikipedia pages

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 No.1271

>>1270
Perhaps Russel's A History of Western Philosophy.

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 No.1282

Mostly Thomas Nagel and this book I found on lainchan earlier.
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/22448.You_are_Being_Lied_To

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 No.1283

I'm about halfway through Evola's Ride The Tiger and am really enjoying it.

I'm not well-read in philosophy, having only read a little bit of Nietzsche and Voltaire, but Evola seems to provide a more practical framework to me. I'll probably continue with his other works when finished

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 No.1298

>>1269
>Essays by Michael Montaigne
get onto this ASAP.

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 No.1759

personal philosophy:
I started studying physics to gain understanding about reality (not a joke, fundamental physics really was the reason). I hated the experimental courses, and always aimed for theoretical physics. I wrote my bachelor thesis in mathematical physics.
I got far enough to realize that if an answer lies in that direction, it will be of mathematical nature. I don't claim to understand the bleeding edge of fundamental physics research, but I've seen the broad strokes.
For some time I was somewhat nonplussed, but as I got more into mathematics I began to understand that mathematical objects have their own reality; They are very real objects of study, as real as what is studied in physics. I began to feel that mathematical reality surpassed physical reality: Mathematics is unassailable in a way that physics can never hope to achieve. I can imagine a universe in which physics works differently. A universe in which mathematics works differently is inconcievable, and while it's difficult to explain why, I don't feel that this is because of a lack of imagination.
Given that mathematical objects are real, why not simply define the universe to be some complex mathematical object? Physical reality thus arises from mathematical reality.
Meanwhile I've switched my field of study to mathematics, which I'm currently pursuing.

There you have it. I realize that this sounds very esoteric, but It's more than just a pet theory, it's the best explanation of reality that I have. "Belief" is not a good word for philosophical questions, but if I believe in anything, it's this.

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 No.1761

>>1759
PS: Maybe one of you guys who's read a lot of philosophy can identify some established theory in this?

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 No.1772

>>1759
You may be interested to know that the mathematics of Information Theory (born from the physics of Thermodynamics) applies to Cybernetics and Quantum Mechanics. There has been some work on epistemology based in information theory. Such philosophy could bridge mathematics and ethics and provide answers to hard questions... However, many philosophers would rather fundamental questions remain unanswerable and dismiss out of hand application of what they call "cold calculation" to philosophy. I find this interesting since philosophy was founded in logic.

Likewise, Cybernetics can give us a mathematical playground for testing the concepts of philosophy and sociology. And yet, it is woefully understudied by philosophers and sociologists. This is where I lost respect for most philosophers today, and the field of philosophy in general. Despite the desire for authority over such subjects, Philosophy can not have a monopoly upon Understanding, Reality, and universal truths because there are no true dividing lines between the sciences in nature.

Whether humans realise it or not a mathematician is simply a different kind of philosopher than a cybernetician, physicist, or musician.

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 No.1774

>>1761
the path has been walked before and I believe it is something like logical positivism, a 20th century idea that was later abandoned for a few key reasons
https://www.phy.duke.edu/~rgb/Philosophy/axioms/axioms/node45.html

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 No.1775

>>908
Reading Aurelius' Meditation and Thus spoke Zarathustra at the moment. Liking both of them, does anyone have any recommendations?

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 No.1794

>>908
good ol' Proudhon.

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 No.1795

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>>1761
Relevant.

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 No.1804

>>1775
If you enjoy Aurelius journal then you should read about the philosophy he based his life on and that book on, Stoicism.


Here's a good book on the subject:
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/5617966-a-guide-to-the-good-life

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 No.1805

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History and Class Conciousness, feels really relevant today when so many leftists movements has become more interested in calling out any independent thought and reduced their theory to how they feel about things.

>>1772
The generally problem with applying logic as the basic of everyday human life is that logic must always base itself on very arbitrary presumptions. For example, utilitarianism must presume that happiness is desirable.

The difference between logic-based analytic philosophy and continental is that the latter is more interested in the great divide between experience and what we can actually say about it.

Philosophy has the monopoly on truth for it is only by philosophy that you can argue for why your theories can be considered truthful.

In the philosophy of science, good examples are Popper's theory of falsification and Kuhn's theory of paradigm shifts. Pic related.

>>1795
>psychology is just applied biology
Jesus xkcd keep that autism in line sometimes.

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 No.1813

>>1805
>>psychology is just applied biology
>Jesus xkcd keep that autism in line sometimes.

That was the least objectionable thing in that comic.

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 No.1841

I am enjoying Thus Spoke Zarathustra at the moment. Is Nausea worth a read, or should I skip straight to Being or Nothingness?

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 No.1845

>>1841
Both are shit; I recommend Phenomenology of Perception by Maurice Merleau-Ponty or one of Camus's novels if you must.

Kierkegaard has a certain kind of beauty. Wittgenstein's notebooks are enlightening. You may as well read more Nietzsche if you like him. Twilight of the Idols and the Anti-Christ are both especially sharp.

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 No.1846

>>1775
Epictetus: Enchiridion
and other works by Stoics if you can find them. There's a list of the most prominent stoics on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Stoicism

As for Nietzsche, try Beyond Good and Evil or Twilight of the Idols.

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 No.1878

I was about to ask if anyone can recommend some good pyrrhonist texts, but... I dunno if there's any. Like, can a text be really pyrrhonist if it's written down? Maybe I should just read whatever and think more than usual about it.

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 No.1879

>>1813
If that were true, I don't think anyone would even be posting on this imageboard.

Biology is straightforward but psychology is far from Universal. If it were, everyone would be 100% under the control of the powers that be already.

It would be as simple as finding the right words for each culture, or using the right drug to keep everyone from misbehaving. Psychologically, however, both chemicals and words can, and often do, have different effects on different individuals.

Just my two cents; I'm not the anon you're responding to.

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 No.1880

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 No.1912

>>1841
I haven't read Being or Nothingness yet but Nausea is pretty good.

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 No.1930

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A >>1805
>utilitarianism must presume that happiness is desirable

Maybe this is above my head, but why is this an issue? Seems like a non-problem pulled out of thin air to me

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 No.1931

>>1930
I take issue with the idea that happiness has any intrinsic 'desirability.' To me happiness has an evolutionary function and beyond that it doesn't matter. Trying to base an ethics system on maximizing it is just silly.

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 No.1932

>>1931
You're starting to sound like a nihilist.

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 No.1933

>>1932
That's what I've been called when I brought it up IRL, but it's not quite right. I just think it doesn't make sense to assign some value to a particular kind of emotional state just because it feels right. I don't deny the possibility of morality and meaning to life, but I don't claim to know what it is either.

(I'm not the same person you were talking to previously, >>1931 was my first post ITT)

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 No.1935

I've bee reading some of the socratic/platonic dialogues. socrates has an awful habit of putting words in others' mouths and I think thats where plato got it from

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 No.1936

>>1933
Every time I've thought I'd found the "meaning" of life, the truth was I had just made an error of reasoning. A good example of this is how Ayn Rand derives morality. It's really exciting if you fall for the trap, it feels like the truth, but really the key of her argument is a non-sequitur.

Just like the lack of evidence of God tells us we shouldn't believe in a God, the lack of evidence for any proposed objective morality tells us we shouldn't believe in objective morality. Personally, I don't need an objective morality to know that I value my own happiness, and the happiness of others. I want to maximize these things. These are things I want without being told to want them. I call this morality, but I wouldn't object if you called it nihilism.

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 No.1937

>>1931
Utilitarianism can also be viewed as a theory that attempts to maximize the "good" (utility) of an event's outcome, indifferent to how that "good" is defined. It doesn't necessarily have to be hedonistic in nature.

You claim to be afraid of making "assumptions." That may sound like a noble and educated pursuit in everyday conversation, but I have a feeling if you inspect your life, you will realize that, not only do you make assumptions every day, but that they make the world go round, often in a good way.

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 No.1938

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have some spores but haven't takn the plunge yet

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 No.1939

>>1937
Yeah, I think a lot of utilitarianism makes perfect sense, but not the hedonistic part.

I don't have any problems with making assumptions. Dunno where you got that from.

>>1936
I never thought I'd found the "meaning" of life. I think if there is one, it will require a much better understanding of the universe than the one we have now.

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 No.1983

>>1936
New to the thread but I pretty much agree with you anyway.

I don't think that necessarily means that it's a bad idea to impose a common set of morals so as to deter people who would be less naturally altruistic, though.

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 No.1990

I minored in philosophy because it seemed like quick easy path to earn study credits. It was, took me less than a year to complete that minor. Then the damn thing stuck on me big time, mostly thanks to political philosophy course which could be called massive eye-opener in many ways (that there is more than one idea of what is justice really shook me to core, it was unthinkable before). Another shaker course was classics, where Anscombe dissects what intention really means. Sounds boring but holy batman it was interesting! Scored straight A's on both courses.

Then I filled the blanks left by education, reading things university didn't include in curricula (careful with these books, kids!). I read fascist philosophy straight from source (Giovanni Gentile) and traditionalism (Julius Evola) and new right (Hans-Hermann Hoppe). Oddly enough, minor didn't cover even Nietzsche, so him too. Main drive was and is pure curiosity, as entire other half of political spectrum was dismissed from curricula. Evola's "Ride the Tiger" was another massive shaker. Not because it's particularly good in analytical sense, but because it was like "waaaah?? this kind of ideas can be formulated on paper in coherent way??". So off the whack of what is considered "normal" so to speak. Also the first in this category I've read.

During the past year I've been reading into neo-reactionary philosophy (Nick Land and Mencius Moldbug mostly). Considering how new neo-reactionary thought is, I think it spawned in early 00's, it's also most fascinating. Moldbug's "Open letter for open-minded liberals" (excellent read, all of them) is intended as easy text for unwashed, but I think it still prerequires philosophical foundation (Anscombe, Russell and Nozic/Rawls suffices) to fully appreciate. What makes neo-reactionary thought so interesting is timing and method. It is basically highly amped version of critical theory without any goal other than trashing the entire whig history and associated philosophies. The best part of it is that it all makes oddly much sense. The timing is interesting because it reinforces the central tenet of Cathedral. I mentioned that my minors curricula didn't include right-wing philosophies. Why? Likely because it is not considered important and there is limited time for humans to study something, so the faculty needs to select what to give students to read. Obviously the things that are considered most important are the philosophies with most impact today, which are... yup, we have identified the self-perpertuating cycle here. Add to that notion from Evola that societies are constructed from above and voilá, nous avons l'Eglisé! Why early 21st century? It is no coincidence neo-reactionary thought popped up in Internet age, as we can clearly see from my example. Defying 300 years of that perpetual cycle requires access to information outside the Cathedral. That is my hypothesis at this point, again supported merely by one more anecdote. University library had one book by Giovanni Gentile, in storage, by order, printed in 60's. Memory holes do exist, but they are not considered bad. Things just go out of fashion so to speak, so obviously as things drop off curricula less people get exposed to ideas outside the cycle, letting the cycle to continue. Again, my initial hypothesis, certainly full of holes and brainfarts at this point.

I think that neo-reactionary thought will end up as one of the big things to happen in field of philosophy by 2030's solely on basis that it is solid, interesting and very different yet familiar. The complete trashing of past 300 years sure makes it easy to label as edgy trilby stuff, but also so very interesting. Check it out. But at least read Russell's "Problems of philosophy" before it for some foundation.

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 No.2057

>>1983
I was new to the thread too, I guess that wasn't obvious.

Sorry if I misunderstood you - do you mean that it's a good idea to tell people that e.g. murder is wrong and altruism is good?

I think those statements are true, in the sense that they represent my attitudes. I don't think they are true in the sense that they represent objective features of the world. I would have no problem with teaching children (imposing on them) that my morals are true, because I prefer that people don't murder.

>>1990
I follow a lot of Less Wrong users on Tumblr; none of them are reactionaries. I have not heard good things about Moldbug. IIRC, and I probably don't, he used shoddy statistics to prove that life under monarchy was more prosperous than it is now. Though the first few parts of his Open Letter are so far mostly agreeable and mildly entertaining. Can you give some examples of NRx ideas that you think are useful or interesting?



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